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09/20/2009

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Steve

It is amazing how little you understand. Whether you want my pity or not, I feel sorry for you.

George

"Humans are brilliant at this. They PROJECT their own inner beliefs onto the external world. Hence they SEE what they WANT to see."
-- LMAO, says the REALIZED.

George

"What are beliefs? They are statements that you consider to be TRUE. They may not BE true - but they are to YOU. And that is the point. Once they are true for YOU - they become true, PERIOD."

Depends what you mean by belief, i for example believe the theory of evolution to hold generally TRUE as well as Einstein relativity, but i dont believe they are absolutely true, in fact i am almost certain that one day they will be improved upon.

The main about a belief is that it is subjective, so when i start a sentence by I believe, i am saying at this point in time i consider the following to generally be true, but such a belief may change with time or if other evidence is presented.

I believe YOUR realization is merely your own subjective belief. This is fine, but it does not make it objectively true, and unlike the theory of evolution or relativity, there is no evidence to support it.

Osho Robbins

Steve,
I would welcome your deeper understanding, which would be a lot more constuctive than just saying I understand so little.

Pity and feeling sorry are really not relevant. If you have a better understanding - I would welcome your comment. Perhaps you would care to share your understanding.

Osho Robbins

George wrote: "I believe YOUR realization is merely your own subjective belief. This is fine, but it does not make it objectively true, and unlike the theory of evolution or relativity, there is no evidence to support it."

Realization is NOT a belief at all - neither subjective nor objective. By the way - there are NO OBJECTIVE beliefs. Beliefs, by their very nature are subjective.

You may choose to THINK that relization is a belief - but that is YOUR belief. Realization is beyond thinking and beyond belief/doubt. beliefs are within the mind. They are part of your conditioning. You cannot understand Realization - and you are trying to understand. It will never happen. At the most you can THINK you understand it. You can also say to a Realized person "You just THINK you are realized."
This is because all you know of is the mind. Realization or direct insight without mind intervention is outside of your range of experience - hence you can only doubt it.

George

You still have not described how human can percieve or REALIZE anything without using the mind. I argue that every single thought, belief, feeling, emotion, instict, understanding, intuition, recognition and realization are either filtered through or manifested by the mind, there is no other way we can experience reality.

"Realization or direct insight without mind intervention is outside of your range of experience - hence you can only doubt it."
--- Of course it is. Little green men, God and flying unicorns are also outside my range of experience, just because someone says they have REALIZED them, why would i believe them?

On what ground would a neutral decided between a REALIZER or false prophet or delusional?

Osho Robbins

George, nobody is even ASKING you to believe anything at all. I have already made it clear that BELIEF is NOT required. You seem to be stuck in BELIEF/DOUBT. I do not ask for your belief - Your belief is irrelevant.

The purpose of a Realized being is not to give out any teachings - because truth is beyond all teachings - it is not theory. The purpose is to WAKE you up - only if you want to be awakened. If you just want proof in words - it cannot be given because words are only a representation. Words are a map and you have to enter the territory.

George - you are seeking an intellectual answer - not a real answer - and it cannot be given.


It is as if we are standing by the river and you are asking how it is possible to experience the water. You have only ever TALKED. You ask me for proof that I have experienced the water. What proof can I give? No proof can ever be enough. If you ask me to help you and you are sincere - then I may push you into the water and you will find out for yourself.

George - ALL you have ever known is the mind. And you are seeking answers within the mind - and I don't have any because I am not interested in mind-answers - which are theories. If you want to jump in the water - that is a different matter. But you don't want to jump - you just want proof that the water is real. The only proof is for you to jump - no amount of debate if going to answer the question. Truth is a QUEST - not a QUESTION.
A new born child - does he have a developed mind - is he able to think? So does that mean the child does not experience anything? Experience and interpretation are two different things.

George

an intellectual answer is a real answer, intellectually we have planned and made real objects which do real things. If it were not for our intellectuality, we would be absolutely no different from the rest of the animal kingdom.

I don't seek answers, with respect, you have none imo.

However, you have lauched a public blog making various statements about a so-called REALISED person, and so i am asking if you have any reasoning at all to support these statements. Specifically, if a disciple wanted to 'get it' (not me since imo there is nothing to get), how would he be able to seperate a real REALIZED master from a false prophet or delusional?

sam

Every sant mat want to save you from death.So far people are dieing left and right. Yet they claim no one can kill soul so how can soul dies?
It is all to control people and make money.

I think I should start sant mat there is lot of money to be made in it. It is pyramid scam. People are willingly join into it.

Marcos

Dears,

It's sad to see people discussing about something they don't understand. Have you ever tried to reach Sach Kand? How can you say "it's a rainbow"? The things we can witness inside...
This other guy...Sant Mat has GIVEN me books, panflets, support, no false promisses, inititation is free, no money asked, quite the opposite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Think about your souls my friends, because MIND has got his grips on you
By the way...pyramid...Do you work for one!: your JOB

God bless all of you

Marcos

The masters are for real...Their powers are beyond understanding, trust me because we humbly can testify this.
Die while you live instead of intelectually arguing about this or that, then one may begin to understand what is the meaning of "the kingdom of God is inside YOU"...

Mind has to be surpassed. It's possible to die while living, to see the planets, stars, universes, samadhi at the end. No doubts...Stop being a fool and meditate...

God Bless all of you guys
Marcos

satish bhagat

well its ur perception and general belief that destract u from the path of reality. i dont believe in religion but one thing i know that this world is full of mongrals(street dogs) like u who know nothing bt they act as they r intermediater of everything . really i feel pity for u.
i thing u r making the comment but ignoring the fact that one hundred thousand or lakhs of people may become fool but to make million of people fool is a differnt concern. there r plathora of people acrosss the world who know what s the differnce between reality and non reality.any ways radha soami to u poor creature....

The True Seeker

Satish,
you are creating your own reality. There is no need to feel pity for me. My journey is complete. I have been to REAL MASTERS and they have put me through what it takes to realize the truth.
You, on the other hand have nothing but empty words.
Reserve your pity for the person who needs it most - YOU.
Radha soami to you too - you poor deluded mongral

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